Instancing

What do you all think of instancing? Some people love it, and some people hate it. What is the perfect balance in MMORPG's?

I personally like instancing because it allows you and your friends to travel through areas uninterrupted. It allows scripted events to run a lot smoother for players as well. I think the best instances are the ones with a good deal of random element so that it's not exactly the same every time (for example: a trap or ambush that moves every time you enter or chests that are hidden in different places).

The best balance I think is to have as much instanced content as uninstanced content so that players can choose which type of environment they want to be in.

Instancing is good to a certain point. I've played a quite a few different games with different types of instancing from eq1 and vanguard with NO instancing to guildwars with everything instanced. Also played the in between games of wow and eq2 that do some instancing.

I enjoyed the eq2 and wow versions of instancing better then guildwars. Whenever its instanced to the point you can only meet people while trying to form groups, you don't really get to help anyone in the moments they need it. (like being knocked unconscious and all of a sudden seeing an arrow hit the mob from behind saving your life)

I like the idea of raids being instanced, this way you can run specific event scripts without others in the area not part of the group disrupting it. You can minimize lag for raids as you don't have to worry about rendering more then the max members of a raid. You can do alot more with an encounter when you set limitations of how many people can be in a zone.

On the same note I like SOME dungeons being instanced. I think eq2 has a good mix of group dungeons and instanced dungeons. you just have to make sure that the group dungeons have enough named, good enough loot, and a reason to bring groups in there.

I think all solo stuff should be open zones non instanced.

so yes, instancing is good to a certain point.

I'll admit, I do like some instancing. Not a lot, but some!

You both have very valid reasoning that I agree with. And like in Guild Wars, as well, sometimes I just liked going in and wandering alone without all the world chatter and occasional idiot spam and commentary.

There are times you just need that "alone" time to be able to escape RL and look at a different world, get jarred back to that reality by an occasional bad guy and just be responsible for yourself and nobody else....kids included!

It's great with friends, but the worst is having some stranger bail out on you after they get what they've come for. This has happened a few times to me when friends/guildies haven't been able to group for for an instance. So you have spent a good chunk of time getting to a certain point and then someone ninjas loot and disappears, leaving you with insufficient force to finish the instance (or no healer, or whatever). Then you waste even more time spamming the LFG channel trying to get a substitute. Grrr!!!

Yeah, but that happens whether you instance or not!! Unfortunately, way too often. Greed is a by-product of MMO's and is one reason so many have refused to group outside of their guildmates.

I would prefer a variance of this between instanced and open. As I think that combination equates to awesomeness. Playing both Guild Wars and WoW for enough time I've figured that overall the balance between the two is essentially providing artificial limits such as in WoW:BC you could only reach some areas once you had a flying mount. That is in its own way a type of instancing. WoW imo went overboard and made all meaningful loot gathering in instances. (Even crafters had to run em to get mats for the gear they make.) One way though I have yet to see is a seasonal instance system. One that makes certain dungeons the center of activity and some may be blocked off. Others just go into hibernation until certain events occur. If a MMO would say scale the instancing like say what I will post after this it would make instances valuable yet not the only way to progress.

World Events-(Unqiue only happen once and will eventually turn into a dungeon that is just there.)

Seasonal Events-Instances are active only during certain times or during certain plot moments.

Active Events- Instances that are persistent and are pivotal to the story of an MMO. These MMOs may change over time, but will always be active.

Permanent Active Events- Instances that like the above are persistent and pivotal in the MMO world, but with a catch. It never changes much in the sense of major changes(I.E. world events, Seasonal Events.. ect.).

Instancing brings its own problems to the table though in regard to whether or not its viable compared to open combat. I will say from what I've read and from what you guys have posted that open combat in an MMO will provide problems. The only viable option I can surmize for this type of action is an semi instanced/semi non instanced area. What I mean by this is that make an area that requires certain requirments to enter. Multiple groups can enter this area till one server load of it is full. Then it is up to the player groups to defeat the Named Mobs. This is not a raid. The groups do not work together and they most likely will have different reasons for entering the area. The system I hope for is closely akin to maybe say one such as that of LOTRO with its Monster PVP system. Anyway now I'm just rambling.

On a side note: I am strongly against PvP being penned up in Battlegrounds like WoW did. Murdered World PvP, although, it gave it a purpose.

Summary: I vote for a mixture between them as just one solid way doesn't fit. I.E. Guild Wars is hard to consider an MMO because of that. On the other hand open combat leads to many community problems and will just make people leave by frustration. Certain types of instancing such as PvP and questing need to be developed correctly as to not pinch off other parts of the game. (Community, Open War, Social Aspects.. ect.)

Instancing is just a way to make an MMO a 6 player co-op. Where is the challenge? Where is the community? It's not always a pretty community, but it's a community nonetheless. Some speak of people leaving out of frustration by too much competition in an open world, but that's sort of the point of an MMO. If someone doesn't want competition, go play a single-player game. I know it's harsh, but that's how I feel.

I feel like I use to know you back in EQ! We seem to share many thoughts.

Community has deteriorated, imo, because of some things you've discussed: Instancing and quests, namely. There is more, but we'll just mention those for now.

Now, I do understand certain aspects of instancing, i.e. Guild Wars. With it not being a true customer-support-based game, the instances are a way to get away from the "lamers" and kids that ruin the fantasy/world for some of us. I finally quit playing because of that. EQ is still my fantasy! OLD EQ, not what they turned it into by relaxing naming policies and out-sourcing their GMs and changing the world around. Many of my favorite places are gone now and I've also quit playing that.

I keep hoping for that amazing feeling again and a good, strong community that wants to explore and not have a game be another job. I WANT to be there. Not feel like I have to be!